Imports.

Graeme · Post by **Graeme** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 15:08

Five years ago The term numbers matching meant nothing in this country.all of a sudden people dicovered it meant more money when selling their cars so it was great to have a numbers matching car because it meant more money.Yes I agree with what you say about making a standard firebird into a formula 400 when it didn't come out like that or putting a chevy motor into a ford,that's wrong but numbers matching means something if you work at Barret Jackson and you want top dollar but driving a numbers matching 455 GTO against a unmatching numbers 455 GTO feels the same to me.

Tony69 · Post by **Tony69** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 15:34

Fair enough... but having a 69 firebird with a 400 built in 80 is not the same as a 69 Firebird with a 400 built in 69. It's not about value for me, but about having it the way it should be.

Speaking of money... Why do you guys think there are so many 67 Shelby clones & not many of the other models?
Sure... the Shelby naturally looks better than the Ford... but most of the time, the guys that build them, do so to sell them. They know everybody wants one, thanks to the movies, musclecar enthusiast or not. They know, sooner or later some snot nose kid that knows exactly jack about musclecars will walk in with Dad's checkbook. Do you think they care if the car falls apart after a year? The car probably cost them half (or less) what they're asking for it. They build them to make a quick buck & thats it. Take a look at the one built in Cape Town & sold to a forum member. Any tosser stupid enough to pay that kinda money for a car like that almost deserves the car. Re-engineered classic??

dkatz phoenix · Post by **dkatz phoenix** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 15:46

What is so fantastic about a 69 Firebird 400 built in 1969. You arn't talking rarity here are you. I promise you that if you add a few extras to your 69 firebird nobody would give a shit. Its not exactly the rarest car out there now is it? When i talk rare I'm talking about a Yenko or a Copo etc. I would not touch that. My cars are for driving and giving people in the street an opportunity to see smell hear and taste what a real car looks like.

You carry on building your not rare 69 Firebird into a museum piece...........

Tony69 · Post by **Tony69** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 16:17

Just so you know... I've got a Chevy 350 in my museum piece

I am not at all happy about it but It'll do for now. The performance, sound & feel of a newer 400 is just not the same.

True... its not a yenko or copo. (thanks for pointing that out btw

) But it is a factory convertible, is a date correct motor too much to ask for it? I just missed out on one in junkmail about a month back. But who cares...there are 11000 Firebird Convertibles, so what if one has a Chevy350

I really can't give a damn about people in the street. They can laugh (as some do) or shout "Mustang!! check the Mustang!", I really don't care. The car is for me & not for showing off. Call me crazy

Graeme · Post by **Graeme** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 16:51

I wouldn't even touch a numbers matching car after 1970 because of the terrible drop in horsepower.example a 400 cu in 68 for a GTO would be rated at 375 HP.The same motor in 72 was rated at 210 HP.now you take that numbers matching 72 400 and beef it up,then the numbers matching originality would be blown out the window.It's a waist of time unless you want a museum piece.

Graeme · Post by **Graeme** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 17:42

Tony my mate has two 400 Pontiac motors in mafikeng.I will check the casting date and year and you might be in luck

Post by **ZA Perana** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 17:55

Interesting debate but I beleive if the car is orginal to begin with and has matching number it should be restored to as such, however its a shell and missing its orginal motor then do what you like with it. My point is there have been great original cars turned into less than orginal cars by silly add ons and the like.

At the end of the day its up to you what you do but I for one wouldnt dump a 302 out of a Can Am and shove in a 350....likewise I wouldnt throw a 302 out of a Perana and put in a 351....

I have to agree with Graeme though that 5 years ago numbers matching meant nothing, now it merely means money...at the end of the day we all have our likes and me I far prefer a Firebird or Camaro to look orginal rather than have these ridiculous bonnet humps and 22 inch wheels, my preference though.

Tony69 · Post by **Tony69** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 19:33

Awesome...

The casting number should be 9790071 (preferably)

Thanks Graeme

Graeme wrote:Tony my mate has two 400 Pontiac motors in mafikeng.I will check the casting date and year and you might be in luck

Stealth GT · Post by **Stealth GT** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 19:58

You guys are seriously mistaken if you think that people have been chasing numbers matching cars for the last five years Take a guy like Lino that has been collecting parts for his Canams for the last 25 years to get them back to original and there are / were plenty like him
I once swopped the starter off my 57 Ford with a guy because mine had the correct Ford logo on it to me he was plain f@cking nuts I suppose toady he's the clever one

One has to remember that the people that go on about matching numbers are just out to protect their investments they are probably the ones that bought in five years ago today the hobby is just about $$$$$$ I take my hat off to the guy that takes his genuine Shelby or Yenko or any "muscle " even Daves JAG

and abuses it thats what they were built for

Regarding those imported Mustang "Cagey" clones not my scene but give me one of those without the Elanor exterior bits and the Carrol shelby signature and Ill be Happy

Warren

dkatz phoenix · Post by **dkatz phoenix** » Sat 23 Oct 2010, 20:41

Dear Graeme

I think that your philonthropic offers to Tony may be a little misguided. The man is on a quest for a numbers matching 400. Something lying around Mafeking is not going to cut ice. Tony if you give me your VIN, I'll decode it for you. 10:1 your engine may be a stright six and government brown may be your paint code. You may just have one of those bottom of the line VIN. Just post it up on the forum and I'll get stuck in for you.

Ive got a numbers matching 1972 Corvette. Its original numbers matching 350 put out 180HP. I kept the numbers matching block and heads and stroked it to 383 putting out 430HP. Please ask Graeme how happy I am when I blasted a numbers matching Pontaic 455 into the ground. All the tosser in the Pontiac could say was" Is that a numbers matching Vette? "

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